Curse

blarb · Jul 28, 2006, 06:04 AM // 06:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tark Alkerk

i hope your joking,
if not your going to need this
*hands blarb a flame retardant coat*

Well the neat thing is, I can entertain and humour myself without having to joke. Regardless, I'm right, you'll learn.

Btw, I don't need a flame retardant coat. I could care less about the opinions of people. People are trash, not worth the dirt on my boot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Lozza

Girls, like myself, dress the way we want to be perceived. I'll go out in next to nothing if I want to be looked at, yes girls do like to be able to turn heads. What is NOT warrented, however, are wolf-whistles, "slut" comments, gestures, and "hands-on" involvment unless EXPLICITLY invited.

You're living in a logicless dream, like most women (heh), where dressing indecently should not provoke indecent comments/gestures. The sad thing is, that dream is not without reason. Nobody should waste their time with you, you're obviously attention seeking and probly ridiculously needy. Regardless, the bottom line is, when you do somthing ("I'll go out in next to nothing if I want to be looked at") to get attention like a child and ego boost, you aren't going to be able to pick and choose. Live with it, and stop b*tching.

shalom

Lady Lozza · Jul 28, 2006, 06:05 AM // 06:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talon one

i guess thats what this thread is about. you cant dress with the intention of beeing able to turn heads and still be treated with respect. well, you can expect it or even demand it, but its not going to happen.
whammos are everywhere

Oh so now we are back to the stud vs slut argument. Guys can dress in a provocative manner and it makes them sexy and stylish. For a woman to portray herself in such a manner makes her a slut. Geez, funny old world. Women have been "liberated" for over half a century and we're still expected to pander to delicate male sensitivities. If a short skirt and a bit of bust is enough to distract them that is THEIR problem, and they ought to keep it to themselves.

Just because mainstream (male) society chooses to treat women in such a manner doesn't mean that it is okay for them to do so. Last time I checked wolf-whistles and loud comments were classified as harrassment.

Quote:

Your just assuming I think that way, but you are clearly wrong, I'm just pointing out that this type of thing happens more often to the type of girls that dress in a perticulor way.

Just because it happens, doesn't make it right. And for the record, many rape victums are "respectibly" dressed.
If a guy can't keep it in his pants, he should seriously think about getting it chopped off.

Samuel Dravis · Jul 28, 2006, 07:35 AM // 07:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Lozza

Oh so now we are back to the stud vs slut argument. Guys can dress in a provocative manner and it makes them sexy and stylish. For a woman to portray herself in such a manner makes her a slut. Geez, funny old world. Women have been "liberated" for over half a century and we're still expected to pander to delicate male sensitivities. If a short skirt and a bit of bust is enough to distract them that is THEIR problem, and they ought to keep it to themselves.

Just because mainstream (male) society chooses to treat women in such a manner doesn't mean that it is okay for them to do so. Last time I checked wolf-whistles and loud comments were classified as harrassment.

I don't think he was saying it wasn't harassment or disrespectful or w/e. I think he was saying, "that's just the way it is."

>.>

And it DOES seem to be the way it is. I personally don't do that kind of thing but many do. Perhaps if Anet did stricter age requirements some of this kind of thing might go away, but some will still do it. People are bad (except the good ones, of course). ^_^

bele · Jul 28, 2006, 07:50 AM // 07:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Lozza

Just because it happens, doesn't make it right. And for the record, many rape victums are "respectibly" dressed.
If a guy can't keep it in his pants, he should seriously think about getting it chopped off.

nuff said

Actually allmost all victims are respectably dressed. it's the guy that cannot keep it in his pants.

Got all girl avatars but a male Ranger and i had no big harassing problems till yesterday when a W/Mo harassed my grey dyed 15K kurzik Mesmer (nohting slutty but just the opposite, elegant and stilysh).

Didn't found very amusing and zapped to GH.

It doesn't matter how are you dressed, either in GW or RL

I'm a guy btw and love Summer with all women with less clothes than usual. That doesn't mean i have the right to harass them.

Feminist Terrorist · Jul 28, 2006, 08:09 AM // 08:09

Unfortunately it's been like that for a long time. Women have to suffer for men's inability to control themselves. Of course, not all men are like that, but enough are to make things unpleasant at times, and they usually don't think they're doing anything wrong.

Imaginos · Jul 28, 2006, 08:14 AM // 08:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenrath

Kind of ironic to be saying about pervs when most female characters are in fact played by males (of all ages) - and admit it or not the number 1 reason is for oggling at

Ah but you see the difference is that you can enjoy how your character looks (in whatever way you want) by yourself and NOT by forcing any sort of purile behavior on anyone else.

I make my chars female for the fact they are eyecandy to me. Played a male elf in eq for 5 years. Got tired of pixelated male elf butt all the time so now its female characters

female pixelated butt is much nicer.

Ninjutsu Honor Code · Jul 28, 2006, 06:03 PM // 18:03

This wouldnt be such a issue if Anet just changed the warrior dance a bit, just the thrust part then everyone but rapists and molesters would be happy.

Talon one · Jul 28, 2006, 11:17 PM // 23:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Lozza

Oh so now we are back to the stud vs slut argument.

Just because mainstream (male) society chooses to treat women in such a manner doesn't mean that it is okay for them to do so. Last time I checked wolf-whistles and loud comments were classified as harrassment.

there is some truth in that argument, in that most women dont like unwanted attentions while wost guys do like unwanted attentions, because its not really unwanted. the difference is that in one case its just phantasy and in the other its an unpleasant reality. however, when they play a female character in guildwars, they experience the other side of the interaction and see that it sucks when they stand around, minding their own business and suddenly they get whammo'ed.

Quote:

Unfortunately it's been like that for a long time. Women have to suffer for men's inability to control themselves. Of course, not all men are like that, but enough are to make things unpleasant at times, and they usually don't think they're doing anything wrong.

my guess would that 'for a long time' means since before the establishment of civilization?

and i dont think its as easy as 'not all men are like that'. there is always 'a beast in the cellar', 'an animal trapped in a civilised mind'
maybe some men who are not like that may turn out to be like that in the anonymity of a computer game, while others who are like that may not be like that in a computer game. and others yet may not stoop so low either way. pure speculation of course

AJM · Jul 29, 2006, 03:13 AM // 03:13

It's a lose-lose situation if you dress to get attention, ladies. If you don't, it's harder to get attention. If you do, some of that attention WILL be negative. Just like pretty much everything else, there are pros and cons. It's a double-edged sword, and probably always will be, because there will always be guys who can't get a decent lay and therefore vent their sexual frustrations in an obnoxious and offensive manner.

I'm not saying that behavior is acceptable, it's totally not, but to expect it NOT to happen when you dress to turn heads would be incredibly naive.

Oh,Talon, if there's a 'beast in the cellar', it would also be silly to think for a second that it's exclusive to males. Females can be just as nasty, and are probably equally inclined to let this 'beast' out, though they tend to do it in a different manner. I'm not saying you stated it's a male-only thing, but I'm saying this in case that's what was meant.

Feminist Terrorist · Jul 29, 2006, 03:23 AM // 03:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talon one

my guess would that 'for a long time' means since before the establishment of civilization?

Pretty much. lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talon one

and i dont think its as easy as 'not all men are like that'. there is always 'a beast in the cellar', 'an animal trapped in a civilised mind'
maybe some men who are not like that may turn out to be like that in the anonymity of a computer game, while others who are like that may not be like that in a computer game. and others yet may not stoop so low either way. pure speculation of course

There very well may be a beast in the cellar, but real men can control that beast and channel it into appropriate venues.

Whiplashr · Jul 29, 2006, 05:57 AM // 05:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Lozza

Oh so now we are back to the stud vs slut argument. Guys can dress in a provocative manner and it makes them sexy and stylish. For a woman to portray herself in such a manner makes her a slut. Geez, funny old world. Women have been "liberated" for over half a century and we're still expected to pander to delicate male sensitivities. If a short skirt and a bit of bust is enough to distract them that is THEIR problem, and they ought to keep it to themselves.

Just because mainstream (male) society chooses to treat women in such a manner doesn't mean that it is okay for them to do so. Last time I checked wolf-whistles and loud comments were classified as harrassment.

Just because it happens, doesn't make it right. And for the record, many rape victums are "respectibly" dressed.
If a guy can't keep it in his pants, he should seriously think about getting it chopped off.

I'm not going to argue with you to defend the other posters point of view. I know what you are trying to say and I agree that everyone should be respectful to other people.

But really now, why exactly do women wear short skirts, makeup, and show alot of bust?

THEY DO IT TO ATTRACT ATTENTION FROM MEN.

There is no other reason to do it. None whatsoever.

The problem is, you end up attracting attention from men that you do NOT WANT to attract. And then you complain about it.

That's simply the truth. If you dress to attract men, you have no business complaining if someone shows you that attention. If they do it in a rude or harrasing way, then yes, they are wrong to do so. But come on, you dress that way for a reason.. And you KNOW that's true, even though I suspect you'll spin up some great rationalization for it.

To dress for attention, and then to complain about getting attention, that is the height of hypocrisy.

Mera Regila · Jul 29, 2006, 01:05 PM // 13:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cjlr

You know, I really haven't had to deal with that other than one or two one-off situations. Creepy nonetheless, but hardly common.

Maybe it's because I can't afford the really skimpy armour. Though I do wonder about that... What, I'd be paying for what I'm not wearing?

Even though this was on page two i felt the need to respond to it. The armor is less than droks armor, and it gives the same protection. I guess they charge more becuase the armor is more versatile. If it's lighter, theoretically if the game were real the players would move faster.

Just my little theory there.

Shadow of Light · Jul 29, 2006, 02:22 PM // 14:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whiplashr

But really now, why exactly do women wear short skirts, makeup, and show alot of bust?

THEY DO IT TO ATTRACT ATTENTION FROM MEN.

There is no other reason to do it. None whatsoever.

Equivalent: Why, exactly, do men wear tight shorts, no shirt at all, and gel in their blow-waved hair?

Short skirts: It might be hot weather. Would shorts be better? They'll still show leg. Some people might just find short skirts as comfortable garb.

Makeup: It's become, sadly, almost expected of women to wear makeup before stepping outside the house. I assure you, it's not (always) to attract attention from men. For many of us, it's simple self-confidence and presentation.

Show a lot of bust: Well, if you're at... say... the beach, there's little choice in the matter. Unless all women wear wetsuits or t-shirts (which aren't that useful if sunbathing). The revealing clothes might be worn simply for comfort. The woman in question might be busty. Heck, I've been called Lara Croft when I was wearing an oversized t-shirt that revealed no skin below the neck or above the elbows.

Now, we've ascertained that not ALL women wear these things to attract attention from men (if anything, they may bat from the other side of the plate). However, I'm positive there are women who DO.

Just not all of them. Ok?

Please... please have a broader mind than this.

Next thing you know the only 'decent' way for a woman to dress will be with veils and body-length robes. Though I'm sure there will still be any number of men shouting "C'mon! Take it off!"

But your argument is that if one dresses for attention and receives it, it should not be complained about no matter what kind of attention it is. You state that there is such a thing as 'wrong' attention, but then say it's hypocritical to complain about it if one is dressed to impress? Hyopcritical if they're raped? Seeking attention does not equate to seeking any and every kind of attention.

I'll stop there. I'm sure kids read this forum.

Ailyrr Merlena · Jul 29, 2006, 05:06 PM // 17:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow of Light

Short skirts: It might be hot weather. Would shorts be better? They'll still show leg. Some people might just find short skirts as comfortable garb.

Makeup: It's become, sadly, almost expected of women to wear makeup before stepping outside the house. I assure you, it's not (always) to attract attention from men. For many of us, it's simple self-confidence and presentation.

Show a lot of bust: Well, if you're at... say... the beach, there's little choice in the matter. Unless all women wear wetsuits or t-shirts (which aren't that useful if sunbathing). The revealing clothes might be worn simply for comfort. The woman in question might be busty. Heck, I've been called Lara Croft when I was wearing an oversized t-shirt that revealed no skin below the neck or above the elbows.

Lady Godiva rode a horse in the nude. Was she a prostitute? Was she a slut? Did she ask to be raped?

Those of us who are female irl don't appreciate the "wrong" attention there, just as we don't appreciate it in-game either.
And if a kind of attention can be "wrong", why are we expected to accept it? Doesn't matter if it's irl or in-game.

And totally off-topic, this is why I'm sooo opposed to the word "rape" in-game. As in "We raped them in GvG".

Rathcail · Jul 29, 2006, 05:38 PM // 17:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow of Light

Equivalent: Why, exactly, do men wear tight shorts, no shirt at all, and gel in their blow-waved hair?

Isn't that like proving the point?

Doug Clifton · Jul 29, 2006, 06:53 PM // 18:53

Here's what you do.

If you find yourslelf getting Wammolested grab a morally decent warrior and have him wammolest them back. I do it all the time to those horny wammos, gets rid of em pretty quickly

Curse You · Jul 29, 2006, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug Clifton

Here's what you do.

If you find yourslelf getting Wammolested grab a morally decent warrior and have him wammolest them back. I do it all the time to those horny wammos, gets rid of em pretty quickly

One of my guildmates did that to a warrior that was bugging our guild leader on his female monk. It ended up as a 3 (male) warrior pile up.

Mister Overhill · Jul 29, 2006, 08:56 PM // 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninjutsu Honor Code

This wouldnt be such a issue if Anet just changed the warrior dance a bit, just the thrust part then everyone but rapists and molesters would be happy.

Well said. If A-net cares about its player base in general, and the kids in particular, it will tone it down a little. Hell, they nerf everything else.

shadowfell · Jul 30, 2006, 12:19 AM // 00:19

Should have known this thread would head down this path. If you are going to change the warrior dance, you have to change all of the dances, because once you start with one, people will keep whining until everything is different than it started. They would have to change the ranger dance, the ele dance, the ritualist dance, and you know what.. I do not like the male ritualist dance either, there is definitely some thrusting detected!! You see, once you start, you cannot stop.

Personally, I am a real life female.. If some warrior comes up and faces thrusts on my character, well.. I laugh it off. I could care less. If he is so sad and desperate,he needs to get his jollies by watching pixels smash against pixels, that is his business, not mine. Some people are taking this way too seriously. It is a game. No one touches 'you'.

As for showing skin, and dressing for 'presentation', remember, the most forbidden fruit is the most unreachable and thickly skinned on the tree. Men desire to see more of what is covered up, and less of what is already in front of them. Just so happens we seem to play in a teenage world and they haven't grown up enough to discover this.

Shadow of Light · Jul 30, 2006, 04:39 AM // 04:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rathcail

Isn't that like proving the point?

Nope. I'm sure that if you think about it long enough you can come up with some explanations as to why guys sometimes 'dress' like that, without needing to resort to 'omg, they're just trying to attract girls'.